Thoughts on Macan

"BadMotorScooter" (badmotorscooter) 01/06/2020 at 09:40 • Filed to: None

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Hey Opponauts, what do you think of the Macan? Is it a real-deal Porsche or a badge engineered hopped up CUV for people that want a “Porsche” but don’t want a Porsche.

I’ve driven a couple and they do drive nicely, especially the S and up trims. They handle well and are generally quick and comfortable. They are a bit compromised for space as a useful CUV, but as a much less expensive alternative to something like a 911 C4 I could see it. But still, does a fast smallish CUV make sense? For a lot less money you can find a lot more utility with a more plebeian badge on the hood.

boredalways > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 09:50

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To answer your first question, it’s the latter.

But thank goodness for those people because you wouldn't have a 911 C4 to even consider without them

CB > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 09:55

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It’s a real Porsche. Porsche makes it, ergo it’s a real Porsche. If Porsche didn’t think it was a Porsche, it wouldn’t be a Porsche, but it’s a Porsche, so it is a Porsche.

There are people who think Porsches aren’t real Porsches. They say the last real Porsches were made with air cooled engines. Or the last real Porsches didn’t have turbos. Or there is only one real Porsche, because it looks the most like an older Porsche.

What these people fail to realize is that the only thing that makes a Porsche a Porsche is the fact that it’s named a Porsche. Everything else is irrelevant.

Porsche.

Milky > CB 01/06/2020 at 10:04

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One counter argument for “ Porsche makes it”:

CB > Milky 01/06/2020 at 10:12

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And? Would you say the LTD is actually a Mustang? Is the Aries a Grand Caravan? The Camaro is really a Cadillac?

412GTI > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 10:15

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I was impressed with one test drive of one. It was even just the base motor with upgraded suspension. I think it’s the real deal if you’re looking for a compact SUV but don’t want to compromise on handling/performance. Pricey doe..

Tripper > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 10:20

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911 is the only Porsche. The Macan is a great car though! My friend had a 15' Macan S that I got a few drives in and I really liked it.

Milky > CB 01/06/2020 at 10:36

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I mean, yea.

I just have a personal problem with paying more for the same engineering.  Same reason is why I dont love CUVs.  Ecosport starts at $20k vs Fiesta’s $15k, no thanks.  

CB > Milky 01/06/2020 at 10:38

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Fair enough, at leas you’re consistent.

BadMotorScooter > CB 01/06/2020 at 10:47

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Yeah, but really, if you are gonna drive a Porsche, get a Porsche. Why bother with an expensive Porsche if it isn’t really a Porsche, unless you just want a Porsche. Porsche makes real Porsches. They also make Porsches. Porsche, there is no substitute, not even another Porsche.

Porsche.

CB > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 10:52

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I mean, at the end of the day, you buy a Porsche because you want a Porsche, no matter the Porsche. Yeah, not all the new Porsches are  the same as old Porsches, but that doesn’t make them any less Porsche. Credit where credit is due, Porsche doesn’t half-ass its Porsches, no matter what Porsche the Porsche may be. I think that’s what makes it a Porsche, how it handles and how the package comes together, not just where the engine is.

This thread must be awful to read.

Porsche.

Future next gen S2000 owner > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 10:56

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I don’t think the target buyer cares much about utility.

Shift24 > Tripper 01/06/2020 at 10:57

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Wait i snt this just the Porsche version of what you  just reviewed? The SQ5

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/oppo-shortish-take-review-2019-audi-sq5-1840830097

Future next gen S2000 owner > CB 01/06/2020 at 10:57

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Marklar.

Textured Soy Protein > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 11:11

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It is a badge engineered hopped up CUV made by Porsche that competes against badge engineered hopped up CUVs from every other luxury brand. Porsche, while historically a sports car specialist , can get into whatever other higher-volume segments they want .

Tripper > Shift24 01/06/2020 at 11:19

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Yes and I’ve got significant wheel time in both but I’d buy neither.

Spanfeller is a twat > Milky 01/06/2020 at 11:31

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The engine is very different, so is the suspension (also the Macan rides on the old Q5 platform so....its only made by porsche now)

Spanfeller is a twat > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 11:32

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I love the Macan, until they make the 912 again, it’s the only porsche I’d seriously consider buying. 

Milky > Spanfeller is a twat 01/06/2020 at 11:48

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Im not saying everything on the MLB isn't good ... just that they are all on the MLB platform, new or old.  

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 11:57

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Stef says it’s a Porsche, therefore it is a Porsche.

Spanfeller is a twat > Milky 01/06/2020 at 11:59

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I understand; I’m just underlying that MLB =/= K body chryslers, these cars aren’t so similar.

Outside of the production floor, a car being MLB is not that important.
Say, an A4 rides on the MLB system, but that doesn’t mean you could put the Bentayga’s W12 in an A4; the Bentayga is half a foot wider.

Some are practically identical, like the A3 and the Golf; but even then you’re dealing with the A3 having more sound deadening, more intrinsic equipment like automatic windows , and a different tuning for the suspension, the brakes, etc .  

Milky > Spanfeller is a twat 01/06/2020 at 12:08

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I get that. I’m just anti giving VAG another $50k for an RSQ8 in a la mbo wrapper.

IMHO  its just giving whatever company a fatter profit margin.

Spanfeller is a twat > Milky 01/06/2020 at 12:17

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But it happens in any situation where more expensive cars are offered; a Mustang has a thicker margin than a Fusion; even if it rides on a bespoke platform....

Shane Moore > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 12:17

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I have a 2014 Cayenne GTS and seriously considered a Macan. Both are definitely 100% Porsche . I got the Cayenne for the glorious V8 soundtrack but I still keep an eye out for a Macan S or Turbo. The PDK is worth every bit of hard consideration. I’d say the Macan is the best for the money, it drives more like a sportscar than any of the other Sport CUV’s (x4, GLC Coupe) the only thing it lacks is emotion from the soundtrack it makes. You have to step up to the turbo with sport exhaust to get anything but thats kinda the point. If you have any little ones it is the easiest compromise to live with. If you don’t then why are you looking?

BadMotorScooter > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 12:42

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Yeah, my kids are teenagers so no little ones. I’ve got a 991.2 Carrera T, which I love, but could use something a little more practical. I’m using my wife’s SUV anytime I need to move people or stuff, which seems pretty frequent. So, I’m wondering if a Macan S or GTS would be enough sports car and utility. 

Milky > Spanfeller is a twat 01/06/2020 at 12:48

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Spend your money how you want mate.

dieseldub > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 13:28

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It’s an Audi Q5, which is a lifted, tall bodied A4 hatch. I can even see the two separate upper control arms in the photo you posted, the classic Audi “virtual steering axis” front suspension that they first implemented with the A8 in the mid 90s, which then spread to the B5 A4, C5 A6 and on and on and on with some small revisions on the same basic principle of having 8 control arms in the front suspension to make a virtual pivot point dead center it the tire.

So, really, it’s more Audi than anything with a Porsche badge. I personally don’t think that’s a bad thing, though. And undoubtedly Porsche put their own twist on it, changing dampening rates, spring rates and steering ratio to get the feel and response they want from the chassis. Though I will say that every Audi ever with the virtual steering axis is pretty numb for steering feedback. The same geometry that eliminates torque steer also means the wheel has minimal leverage against the steering system. They steer accurately, but the feedback is virtually non-existent.

That all being said, there is nothing wrong with having an Audi-engineered AWD vehicle. They are very excellent systems and it will drive very car-like. Sportier than the average SUV. It is a torsen-based AWD system which Audi has generally been making more and more rear biased in recent generations as well as making them slightly less nose-heavy compared to those 90s-engineered models when they first went to that virtual steering axis geometry. At the same time, the old nose-heavy models I never minded too much. I kept trying to remind people that Audi was not trying to make them track-cars, but rather traction -cars. Having them nose-heavy helped you keep steering control in snowy conditions and the AWD originally being more front-wheel bi ased (even being a longi mount drivetrain) system makes sense in those situations where the front would in theory have the most traction due to the weight balance.

But anyway, I’m going way off topic compared to the topic here, but that’s the basic history and evolution behind the design of this drivetrain and chassis.

dieseldub > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 13:33

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You could successfully argue that the Cayenne is all Porsche, since they co-developed it with VW and put their own twist on it. They still absolutely had their own engineering from the start with it and put their own V8 engines in it that no other VAG brand got. The base model V6, however, is still a VW VR6.

And Porsche liked how it came out so much, they lowered it and used the same basic chassis underneath the Panamera, which I found to be surprising. I thought they would have just used an Audi C platform underneath.

But anyway, the Macan is more badge-engineered than anything, though. It is a Q5, which is a tall bodied, slightly lifted A4 wagon, effectively. I don’t necessarily think that’s a bad thing, though. The Q5 is overall a pretty nice and capable vehicle that feels a lot lighter on its feet than a Touareg/Q7/Cayenne.

Darkbrador > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 14:08

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Most people won’t likely believe it , but my Panamera is roomier inside than my wife’s Macan. I wouldn’t call a Panamera a “utility” vehicle per se, so if “ utility” is the name of the game  a Macan may not be the best choice. But twin turbo roar is worth all the utility in the world ... 

Now, the Macan really is a Porsche in the way it handles and hauls @ss. “yeah but blah A udi Q5 blah” I hear in the background ... sure. Same company, shared resources, synergies, it’s not surprising these two car would have lots in common. 

Shane Moore > dieseldub 01/06/2020 at 14:17

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Good point, like you I had a V10 Toureg and cross-shopped 1st Gen Cayenne Turbos with it. Differences were minimal but noticeable enough that through pure driving you would not confuse the two. Haven’t driven the Q5 but the characteristics of the Macan are more Porsche than both my Toureg and Cayenne.

CompactLuxuryFan > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 14:44

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If you’re thinking of trading the Carrera T (which btw) for a Macan, I’m gonna stop you right there. However, if you’re thinking of a Macan in addition to the 911, I would say go for it! It’s definitely a Porsche. Somebody also mentioned the Panamera, but that seems like a whole price class above the Macan.

A n SQ5 or X3 could save you a lot of money while giving you more utility while sacrificing sportiness. Going to a non-luxury brand (Acura?) goes even more that way. You just have to decide if your non-911 car even needs to be sporty at all.

dieseldub > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 15:27

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The weight difference alone will absolutely help with that. Especially when comparing first gen Touaregs and Cayennes for feel. Those with the separate transfer case with low gear were very, very heavy. Especially the V10 diesel. Those would tip the scales over 5800 lbs.

Depending on what engine, I believe the Q5 and Macan come in at 4200 to 4400 lbs, which is still a heavy pig for anything with sporting pretensions, but a hell of a lot lighter than that old V10 beastie.

For whatever it’s worth, the Q5 V6 TDI diesel we got in the U.S., despite having ‘only’ 240 hp, is faster to 60 MPH than the V10 Touareg. lol

That 1400 lb weight difference accounts for a lot!!

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 15:30

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The only downsides to Macan, and to an extent Cayenne as well...

Looks: as a tall riding, versatile, practical 5-door car... it looks good, but the aesthetic doesn’t scream utility. The rear hatch angle and roof length tend to lend to that more than the organic curves and surfacing. Audi is the more utilitarian... Land Rover / Range Rover, and Jeep Grand Cherokee moreso.

I like the looks well enough, but it looks like a tall riding car.

Use: Being a premium vehicle, and a Porsche specifically... I can see where people would seriously hesitate to take it off the pavement, or load it up with garden or landscape supplies, for fear of harming the finish inside or out, or ruining the carpeting.

If you need to be able to go places and carry things that aren’t necessarily going to preserve the vehicle’s condition, and fear of scratches or messes keeps you from doing things... a less ‘ prestigious’ vehicle might not have such an issue about staying pristine. If you don’t care about using a Porsche like any old Ford, Chevy, or whatever... go for it.

One might argue that these reasons are why Panamera Sport Tourismo exists... still practical as a long-roof 5-door vehicle, still AWD, still comfortable, fast, and stylish, but not trying to encroach on the rough and tumble utility aspect... but I think PST might be markedly more expensive than Macan.

These are pretty subjective things about impressions and preferences, rather than any deficiency with the vehicle itself.

And personally, I like that green... but it belongs on a sleeker, smaller car. I wish they still had Rainforest Green, which is a bit darker than that bright primary hue sort of green.

Shane Moore > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 15:46

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I’m in the opposite position, I’m try ing to talk my wife into a macan and I can get a 911 since we currently drive her car everywhere. I’m tired of driving a MINI clubman with 2 kids.... now the Macan would make it easier.

BadMotorScooter > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 01/06/2020 at 15:59

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Well said! I generally don’t have an issue with using a car as intended, but do try to take care of my vehicles. I’ve learned through experience that leasing a car can be especially liberating in this regard. Assuming it can be vacuumed out, or cleaned off, who cares - if it’s a lease!

Agreed on the green color too. I love a good green, but that’s a bit too green for my taste on this car. 

BadMotorScooter > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 16:28

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That sounds like a good plan! My 911 seems like it gets used sparingly, since I can only take one person and have limited space. I don’t want it to become a me-only, point A to A car, which is what it feels like usually. I don’t have room for an extra vehicle, as I’ve got 4 drivers and 4 cars in the household already. So I’m thinking something like a Macan GTS or Turbo might be a  good compromise of Porsche character and fun, with enough practicality to actually get used regularly in the household. Now, too often I find myself admiring the 911 in the garage as we pull out in another vehicle because the 911 won’t do what we need.

Ash78, voting early and often > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 16:54

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Every time I look at one even half-seriously, I find a lightly used A udi Q5/SQ5 or even an older Infiniti QX50 (with the 325-horse V6) and realize how much car I can get for $20k-$30k, with more practicality and probably lower insurance rates.

The Macan is sort of cool, but that profile does nothing for me, aesthetically. OTOH, Porsche is normally top of the list on reliability, which is surprising and nice.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 17:01

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I try to keep things reasonable, but I have a feeling that if we did some of the things in a Porsche Macan that we currently don’t really mind doing in our Grand Cherokee Overland... other Porsche people would probably be shocked and appalled. Maybe not to the extent of subjecting a Boxster/Cayman/911 to that... but still... Porsche should have a halo glow when displayed , or an audible choir tone when spoken, or something to that effect with some people. ;-)

Conversely, on a Jeep, not a big deal if t he paint looks good from 5 feet, but isn’t scratch-free, nor always clean. We take it through brushless automatic car washes (oh, shock and horror!) and there are leaves and twigs and bits of potting soil in the cargo area much of the time, and probably a stain or two in the carpet back there from previous spills. It wears the rubber wet weather floor mats year round.

Saracen > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 17:16

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I love the Macan. It’s really damn good. It feels special. The steering is excellent. Handling is better than any other SUV/CUV. PDK makes even the base 2.0L Macan feel peppy and fun. In fact, the base Macan is probably the best value.

These  things are so good that my dealer says their repeat customers who already own 911's or 718's will often pick a Macan as their daily, even if the Cayenne is well within their affordability.

Downsides? The cargo space is lacking. Which is why I now have an MDX instead of the Macan I really wanted. And yes, with several kids - as long as usually needing to bring a wheelchair - I actually need a third row and that extra space. Otherwise there would be a Macan in my a garage (and there may still be one there some day).

jimithing > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 17:35

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I put a Remus exhaust on my Macan Turbo and I couldn’t be happier with it with two little kids in car seats in the back. 4-ish second 0-60, great handling, goes through anything with the right tires on it.

My only major complaint is the range/mileage. I get only 17mpg, which is atrocious because it’s not THAT heavy, and tank is only ~ 18 gallons. You get a 26 gallon tank on a Panamera GTS (and better MPG) for nearly double the range of the Macan. I love my Macan but the Panamera blows it away at comparable trim levels. It costs ~ 50% more so it better!  

I may scale up to the Cayenne S because it’s getting tight in the back seat of the Macan as my kids are getting bigger. The sills are also quite low so my five year old regularly bangs her head getting in & out (because she has to climb over the car seat bolster).

Before the refresh, the Macan Turbo & Cayenne S used the same 3.6L engine, which is the 4.8L V8 from the last-gen Panamera GTS, but with two cylinders lopped off & twin turbos put on. It’s not a VR6. Not sure what they did with the new 2.9L. 

jimithing > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 17:40

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Go drive a GTS . Put it on low & stiffest PASM setting. You’ll find the S very soft and slow. And if you order, spring for PTV+ (Limited slip diff). Makes it more nimble and even better in bad weather. Happy shopping!

jimithing > Milky 01/06/2020 at 17:44

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The Macan is still on the old platform because they couldn’t make a decision on whether to e lectrify it or not. They’ve decided to do it now so this refresh is to eek 2-3 more years out of it until the electric Macan comes (late 2021/early 2022).

jimithing > Milky 01/06/2020 at 17:45

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To be fair, you’re paying some money for fancier interior appointments as well.

The new Bentley is a Panamera with a lot of  fancy wood in it. As if that’s a bad thing! Such is the car business in the 21st century.

jimithing > Darkbrador 01/06/2020 at 17:52

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Porsche intended the Macan to be more of an empty nester or young family with little kids car. They didn’t want it to be as practical as the more-expensive Cayenne. They also killed cargo space with the sloped hatch. So what did they do? Pushed the rear seats forward several inches from where they are in the Q5. The trunk of my Macan is way deeper than my wife’s GLK and the back seat is much tighter.

The Panamera is 15" longer than the Macan so there's more depth in the back seat and the trunk . It’s a boat - wouldn’t even fit in my garage (I live in the city).

Johnny Powerslide > BadMotorScooter 01/06/2020 at 19:06

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What you need to do is also go to track days, then the 911 will certainly do what you need.

Flyinhigh > Shane Moore 01/06/2020 at 19:34

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We just bought a Macan Turbo and I love it! A DCT is so much better than a slush box which most ther SUVs are - shiver. I found o ther transmissions to be annoying (ex: X6M) . All of our cars are manuals (and loud) so this quieter Macan will need some adjusting. Once that’s done, shifting will feel more interactive, especially if you’re th e type to use sound as a gauge for gears. We also h ave other Porsches in the garage and this is a nice, daily driver addition. The bab y also sleeps well in it and the backseat is comfortable for adults. Recommend !

imadick > BadMotorScooter 01/07/2020 at 12:47

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I like the Macan for a DD. Sporty enough, utilitarian enough, not outrageously expensive (for a luxury car). It’s not a sports car, but I don’t like sports cars as DDs.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > BadMotorScooter 01/07/2020 at 13:21

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GTx cars aside, Porsches are great in that you generally don’t have to worry about retaining value—they will depreciate like a rock, just like any other luxury car. So might as well use them for everything they were designed to do.

The Macan is a   very capable and entertaining everyday car , the Cayenne even more capable and somewhat less fun. If you can accept the small rear seats and limited cargo space, plus  the fact that it’s not actually a sports car, the Macan is probably the best entry level Porsche for people new to the brand.

Chan - Mid-engine with cabin fever > CB 01/07/2020 at 13:23

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Persh.

wafflesnfalafel > BadMotorScooter 01/07/2020 at 19:02

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W e have one Macan and one SQ5 in the garage at work - so it’s a tie.

I personally think both are good looking, though not spectacular. I’d be really hard pressed spending that kind of money on a daily CUV. I’d probably vote for an Outback xt and putting $ 10k in my 401k and $ 10k for my GT4 fund...